No its not.

The trick is, that the UPA genocides are ommitted in Ukrainian history lessons, same as Polish genocides against Ukrainians, Germans, annexation of Czechoslovakia and eastern slavery are in Polish history lessons. A lot of people really do not know, and so UPA are treated as some lovely independence fighters, which maybe some of them might have been, when not collaborating with the Nazis. OFC Zepensky should have known better, as should Nawrocki use this as leverage in whatever negotiations rather than a useless symbolic spat, which only Russian propaganda benefits from.

Nawrocki and the entire PiS are keen to side with Russia as is Targowica’s custom.

edit: typo

tldr

Nah, my entire point is for Russia to fuck off from Ukraine and for you, and people like you, to stop cheering it, since it’s seems to be much for you to comprehend that both “west bad” and “russia bad” might be valid, and that Russia is also an imperialist capitalist state.

This is the prime thing that drives history now a days (…)

You clearly haven’t read Marks.

If you feel so strongly about the war join up and go fight

Just after you move out from the rotten west into Russia or China.

So in the link you posted, isn’t a good example of Russian imperialism, seeing as Communism wasn’t really exclusively Russian movement.

There’s 5 links in the first paragraph of my response alone. Which one are you talking about? And when was I claiming that it was?

They seem more like incidents that happened during the Russian civil war.

This “incident” engaged some 2 million military personel, caused over 100.000 dead and 200.000 mutilated. Not even taking into consideration the lives and livelihoods of people destroyed. I’d love to have your carefree approach and be able to shrug of stuff like this.

I don’t know enough about the background of the Polish republic, but from my very brief reading about it it seems as though around the same time Poland was fighting both the Czech Republic and Ukraine.

Also this happened? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_Coup_(Poland)

Yes, and? It was also an imperialist state beforehand and arose as a slaver state in the first place, enslaving it’s own people. Maybe check the etymology of “slave” and “Slav”. Which is all beyond the point. I’m not claiming any bourgeois state is or was good. My problem is that you seem to be thinking a even more corrupt and exploitative one is justified to wage war on them. And as that means where I live, and most clearly is very far from where you live it is a bit of an issue for me.

As I said I’m sure internal Polish politics were pretty crazy in the 1920s and 1930s like everywhere in Europe but the example you gave me seems like a very bad example of Russian imperialism.

Maybe take a second to read back why 20 and 30’s were crazy for Poland, what happened before. And then we might have a somewhat more informed discussion. Specifically read up on the expansion of the Russian empire and the borders Putin now wants to uphold. Also maybe what the practices were. How that was latter repeated by Soviet Union, a new state, with the same language and mindset. Might give you some understanding why there’s a sizeable number of European states willing to fight against it.

in the structural sense they are though.

In such a “structural” sense your serving your ISP, hardware producers and so on.

with various posters on the internet choosing teams.

My dear friend. I live and work with people who’s cities are bombed by Russia daily. They did not invade Russia, Russia invaded them. You’re an internet larper who picked a side most likely for some misinformed nostalgia for USSR, we live what you cheer. I personally known great comrades who died in Ukraine, because of the Russian soldiers being there and not rebelling against their oligarchic class using them as tools. This is what you cheer.

I just don’t think everything he’s saying about the war in Ukraine is a lie.

You clearly consume media pushing narratives dropping “[Ukrainians are] bandera nazis with a death cult” like some obvious truism, talking for an hour without saying anything but implying the exact same things as Russian propaganda does. No verifiable facts, but the mood in general concepts are set and you stick with it. So yeah, that’s not a surprise, and that’s the very reason we’re having this discussion. Your argument from the very start is that Russia has somehow right to decide what happens outside of it’s borders. It does not and it’s killing it’s own and Ukrainian citizens proving that.

One way to avoid war is not to participate in it.

If I come into your house, smash your face, take your wallet and keep my shoe on your head, what does not participating in that give you?

Which is why I think its strange that conscientious objectors are harassed in Ukraine.

They should not be. Now how are they treated in Russia?

correct term for imperialism, which is when capitalists start a war to secure profits.

My dear friend, not all people are M-L’s, and we don’t have to share you’re definitions conveniently cut in such a way Russian can never be the “bad guys”.

But you and I just have a fundamentally different view of how the world works

Most likely - not in principle. Only yours is limited by a very tight ideological perspective, and I don’t have that comfort of putting made up ideals over reality.

And BTW have you even watched the spy video? What did it actually confirm? The most on point thing he says is that american generals considered the soviet abilities as a threat and were keen on testing their enemy and it was dangerous (beyond a body of literature on that subject there’s also “dr Strangelove…” saying as much or more), and that Austrian capitalists and a British lord support the concept of exploiting Russia. What in that is new or surprising to anyone? I’m having a very find time finding any actual matter in it other then the guys story as a useful idiot (most likely of both sides and a know leftist student is suddenly let into the most highly secured offices where otherwise only intelligence agencies people work…).

Huh? You mean ww2?

No, I meant earlier invasions (1, 2) and post-WW2 occupation of central Europe (1, 2, and so on). But in fairness I could even for WW2.

The west should definitely stop being imperalist.

Yes, absolutely. But so should Russia. The difference here is probably about whether or not one considers Ukrainians to have a right to self determination. You seem to be keen on the idea of Slavs having so such right against Russia.

Idk why you keep responding to me,

I’m offended by people supporting murdering of my neighbours.

spamming me with your ideological takes.

Which in particular of my claims could use a source?

former east German spy

So someone deeply formatted by the “communist” security services believes that he’s side was right? Should I put it against an ex-CIA operative claiming they were right to set up banana republics? Should we also discuss how the same services dealt with internal opposition(1)? You seriously consider a random apparatchik to be a proper source for any information? But I could agree with the general idea. Even if for someone it was not earlier, by now it’s very much clear the US administration in, for lack of better word, playing against Europe. In your style I could mess around and claim that’s because of a colour revolution (1), which set up a corrupt oligarchic pro-Russian leader (1), but that’s beside the point. Still, for example Polish experience of Russia, so some 100 years of occupation (1), a mentioned invasion (1), second mentioned invasion, in cooperation with nazis (1), some genocidal cleansing (1), followed by 50 years of de facto occupation (1) might convince one that it’s better to side with a distant empire against it. People like you like to claim that they have a “geopolitics” or “realpolitic” take on things. This is one, it’s a cynical play of one superpower against the other to have any chance to rebuild after occupation. I could dig up a lengthy youtube essay on that if you were actually interested. You somehow think you’re one of a niche group to understand that. Seem the French committed a dramatic share of their state budget to create their own nuclear program just for fun, since they could have just trusted US.

Bottom line is; the people who you deny any agency are not dying for western corporations, even if one can draw the interests. They are dying to protect their families and communities. Because, as opposed to you, we know Russia for what it is. We know Russians who decided to escape, we know ones who support that state, we’ve been to Russia. And because it, again, invaded the lands where people understand what that means.

Oh and finally; if Ukraine were a NATO trap against Russia - it worked. Russia is already crippled and failing, yet still it would not leave the lands it has invaded, such is its imperialist, expansionist mentality.

Ukraine wanting to revoke the right for the Russian navy to use the port there

Ah yes, so much respect for a sovereign state and it’s decisions. Should all European states do what Russia wants? Is servitude to an imperial mega state which has occupied your region before your concept of freedom?

Europe was always going to be the sacrificial lamb if the cold war were to get hot

You do know, that USSR did attempt to invade central/western Europe and occupied countries in central Europe long before NATO even existed? It’s as if, even if evil, NATO was built using Europeans justified fear of Russian imperial ambitions…

Even if that were the case (which it is not, but I don’t see a chance we could agree on that); is NATO army in Russia, or is Russia in a sovereign state to which it gave security guarantees? Was Crimea out of anti NATO necessity as well?

No, you just parrot Russian propaganda. Merkel is Russia’s lapdog and made German industry totally dependant on Russian resources sold under market prices. Whatever you claim it is Russians invading Ukraine not the other way around.

You even read anything of my comments? Or you just stuck on your script where everything outside of “NATO bad Russia good” is to much to handle? For the last years we’ve been constantly hearing about what we’re allowed to do in our borders from Russians regularly threatening us with dropping the bombs on us. What would legitimate self defence be for that if we were Russian ourselves?
Cuz it sure seems like Russia is the only nation on earth blessed to do anything it wishes against the will of us all living next to its borders. All interest of Russia is above any of the people of Eastern Europe, as westerners always believed. I’m so sorry to have questioned your wisdom sir.

Mate, why would I care about US media? I was around in the early 2000 and we were quite concerned about Russia butchering Chechnya. To the point of being very open to Muslim refugees, which is not something Polish society ever does. Also most of the population supported joining NATO and EU against our protests, for the very reason of threat from Russia. This empire has been our oppressor for some 300 years. Go bullshit some naïve westerners, not the people who’s right to self determination you freely give away.

So Germany was again collaborating with Russia against the will of central and eastern European states and Russia gives itself the right to determine what they do? We have been invaded by the Russian empire before, just as well as the Prussian.

So Russians stepped into an american trap by invading a neighboring country with which they have signed a peace treaty and gave security guarantees to?

States worked for years for regime change in Ukraine, supported leftists (mostly naive anarchists)

Lol.

The Ukrainian people don’t deserve what’s happening to them, but they should be just as angry at the western puppets as they are at Russia.

Correct me if Im wrong but its Russians sending a nightly bombardment of their homes?

So the Russian invasion continues to make things in Ukraine worse? kk.

3. yes normally you would translate (https://weblate.join-lemmy.org/browse/lemmy/lemmy/ka/) and wait for the update. maybe there’s some faster way to deploy it to your server but if I remember correctly and nothing changed you’d have to compile the app yourself

China seems to be waging a influence war against Nepal, so I wouldent be that surprised if Tiktok was used as a weapon there.